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weirder real vehicle than a virtual one

14 comments

i like vehicles that would seem to be more “normal” in the virtual world than the real one

here is one that would be pretty fun to use in the virtual world (go for it Robert! he’s the guy putting in tons of work on the BulletSim plugin). i’d love to have these for students as a self-rezzer so they could zip about on-road, off-road, and over water! FTW! (for the w00t!) =D

check out how the wheels fold in! this it tots from Bond! =)

the Quadski by Gibbs Sports (pocket change at only $40k usd!) o_O

quadski

past wacky vehicles mentioned:
sealander website
motocrossboard website
vacuum train website
fliz bike website

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written by Ener Hax

October 21st, 2012 at 10:05 am

posted in virtual worlds

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14 comments to 'weirder real vehicle than a virtual one'

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  1. Beat them to it!

    Well, sort of. I’m building hover vehicles that run on both land and water :-D

    http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7247/7826084990_1e5f63c53a_c.jpg

    My next goal is to be able to switch from hover to flight :-D

    Sarge Misfit

    21 Oct 12 at 10:39 am

  2. yeah, i love that one you have Sarge – that looks like a wicked pissah!

    so you are my total ninja and expert when it comes to viewers (shifting course, hang on!) – what do you think of Firestorm for someone like me? you have a great idea of what i like to do – build, build, build (and be a hermit) and i trust your recommendations deeply

    thanks! =)

    Ener Hax

    21 Oct 12 at 10:47 am

  3. Thanks for the info.

    I’ve also blogged about it from the perspective of SL, where the idea pre-dates Gibbs by a number of years (2007 in fact) :).

    When real life imitates Second Life.

    Wonder where they got their inspiration from ;-).

    Inara Pey

    21 Oct 12 at 10:59 am

  4. I’ve been using Firestorm in my WorkShop, really good for getting used to the V3 style interface. As builders, it seems to me that being able to do nanoprims down to .001 and hollow to 99% are important. Consider a window, isn’t a pane that is .001 thick more realistic than .01? It also has axis-on-root, mesh support and command-in-chat. The downside is that it is a bit of a memory hog and it doesn’t have an export function.

    When it comes to exporting, if the linkset is unscripted, I use Cool VL. The one problem I have with Cool VL is that it won’t support mesh on my system, though it used to. I think it is related to me having switched to Win7 64bit where I was using Vista 32bit before.

    For scripted items, I use Angstrom as the HPA format keeps contents. But that is a little unstable and sometimes doesn’t include everything. However, that may be due to me not setting my scripts to open permissions or not. I’m investigating that.

    So, between those three, I’ve pretty much got everything covered.

    Using Teapot for grid-hopping and I’m a pretty happy camper :-)

    Sarge Misfit

    21 Oct 12 at 11:41 am

  5. hey, that Menace is really nice! thanks for pointing that out Inara! (also a guru regarding viewers!) =)

    yikes Sarge! i can’t do multiple viewers! i’m a one viewer avatar! =D

    Ener Hax

    21 Oct 12 at 1:06 pm

  6. Well, its the lack of export support that is the big killer on FireStorm, but otherwise, its the one for building. Using different viewers for different tasks seems to be the only solution until someone comes along with a viewer that satisfies my needs. I’d use Cool VL for building but I use nanoprims all the time (vehicle windshields :-D ) and export only once the build is done, plus it lacks command-in-chat.

    Just to digress a bit, command-in-chat is very useful. For example, I have a Gesture hot-keyed to F12 that says “gtp 512 512 4000″ which TP’s me to a platform where I test build heights.

    I do think a stripped down basic viewer with optional, downloadable plugins may be the way to go.

    What does a viewer really need? A way to open boxes and change outfits is enough to get a person going. And being able to move objects, such as furnishings, those should be enough as a basic viewer. Add a plugin for building, another for import/export, one for photos, videos, maybe one for RP.

    Sarge Misfit

    21 Oct 12 at 1:24 pm

  7. I have a multi-modal vehicle script which can switch from Land, to aircraft, to watercraft. It’s a great way to make a single vehicle do different things. The svcripting is of course a tad extensive to accomodate the different modes but mode changes are accomplished when the vehicle mode is selected. Depending on the vehicle design, it could use a sensor system to detect if it’s on land or water and alter it’s configuration accordingly but transitioning to a flying vehicle is a little more difficult and likely best done with the menu driven mode controls. Sorry but the scripts are not opensource and I will not release them into the wild as I have close to 200 hours of development & testing invvolved within that system. The lack of script security at this time prevents the release. I am working on a combination Script Obfuscator/Optimizer/Squeezer but that is on the “when I feel up to it schedule”.

    ODE vehicles are still somewhat difficult to get quite right but the progress with Bullet Physics is slowly getting there and once that is nailed down, we will really see some “damn good physics” instead of just “working decent physics”.

    Re Viewers:
    My Main System Specs are as follows:

    CPU: AMD Phenom(tm) II X4 970 Processor (3515.73 MHz)
    Memory: 12287 MB
    OS Version: Microsoft Windows 7 64-bit Service Pack 1 (Build 7601)
    Graphics Card Vendor: NVIDIA Corporation
    Graphics Card: GeForce GTX 550 Ti/PCIe/SSE2
    Windows Graphics Driver Version: 9.18.0013.0697
    OpenGL Version: 4.2.0

    When I use Cool VL Viewer and have no problems seeing, uploading or using mesh objects.

    My main viewer of choice at present is Zen but I do flip between it and CV depending on what I am doing… CV’s Export/Import XML works a treat for XML. Like Sarge said, no XML Export does scripts or contents which is where HPA can shine if that get’s sorted out in Angstrom we can always hope for it to be incorporated into other OpenSim friendly viewers.

    I have also recently started using Firestorm as a test bed and actually testing my own viewer patches (OSSL and other extensions) against their source and so far it’s looking good. Hopefully they will get something out soon for more OS compatibility & related tweakages. I did have to make a few extra adjustments to FS to improve it’s behaviour / manner but no crashes or major issues. They are not compilling with LAA so the viewer is capped to a max of 2.0GB ram use. You can manually set the LAA flag to allow it to be Large Adress Aware and use up to 4GB of ram.

    Special NOTE re Micro prims, 99 Hollow and Ultra Thin prims. Not all viewers (mostly the older ones) cannot & will not be able to render prims with those geometries. The results can be varied but will usually show as slightly deformed or not at all.

    How to make your Applications LAA enabled.
    (taken from my documentation as written and included with Aurora-Sim\docs)

    WHY ?
    An application running in 32Bit Mode on Windows can only access access 2GB Ram Total by default. The Solution is to patch the EXE to make it aware and to adjust 32-Bit windows to accomodate that (x64 is already capable).

    When a 32-bit application is Large Address Aware, it can access up to 4GB on x64 operating systems and up to 3GB on x86. 64-bit Windows, require no modifications to the operating system to benefit from the Patched EXE files. 32-bit Windows, require some adjustments and they vary according to Version of Windows.
    Linux/Mono do not appear affected by Large Address Aware patched exe’s *** Still needs thorough verification. ***

    How-To Patch EXE

    Method 1) [Tougher way to do it]

    If you have Visual Studio 2008/2010 and/or C++ Express
    COPY your applications EXE to a safe place (backup)
    Copy again to a separate Working Directory (the ones you will patch)

    REFERENCE for EDITBIN
    http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/xd3shwhf.aspx

    Method 2) (maybe simpler and does not require C++ be installed)

    http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=112556
    Above has an APPLICATION in the first posting which makes patching your executables easy.
    See Thread in the link for details.

    Windows Mods Required (not applicable to 64bit)

    ******************************************************************
    *** WARNING – FOLLOW THE DIRECTIONS AND BACKUP BACKUP BACKUP ! ***
    ******************************************************************

    WIN-XP
    Ensure you have View All Files & System Files enabled.
    In the root of C:\ you will see a file named “boot.ini” MAKE A BACKUP COPY OF IT somewhere safe !
    Edit it with NotePad (you must be admin priviledged) and ADD the /3GB switch as shown below

    It will look similar to this example:

    [boot loader]
    timeout=30
    default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(2)\WINNT
    [operating systems]
    multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(2)\WINNT=”????” /3GB

    Where: “????” in the example can be the programmatic name of the operating system versions shown below:
    Windows XP Professional / Windows Server 2003 / Windows Server 2003 Enterprise Edition / Windows Server 2003 Datacenter Edition.

    REFERENCE: http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/system/platform/server/pae/paemem.mspx

    WIN-VISTA
    Vista uses BCDedit. A powerful yet potentially Very dangerous tool !
    Open a Command Prompt (CMD)
    Make a New Directory to preserve a BACKUP of the System Store & change dir there.
    Example: md c:\BCDbackup then cd c:\BCDbackup
    NEXT
    run the follow command IN BCDbackup: bcdedit /export MyFileName
    Where MyFileName is something simple like MyBCD
    NEXT
    run the following command: BCDEDIT /Set INCREASEUSERVA 3072
    NOTE: That is the Maximum assuming you have that much RAM and don’t even try to make it more, the result would be not pleasant.

    !! RESTORING IN CASE OF ISSUES !!
    The following command imports the data from C:\Data\BCD Backup into the system store:
    bcdedit /import “c:\BCDbackup\MyBCD”

    REFERENCE for BCDedit:
    http://download.microsoft.com/download/9/c/5/9c5b2167-8017-4bae-9fde-d599bac8184a/BCDedit_reff.docx

    WIN-7 (Nothing Required, support is already there and better implemented)

    *** CLOSING NOTES ***
    *********************
    By Patching the EXE files, they will use up to 4GB Ram on 64Bit or 3GB on 32bit. This will not force the system and won’t cause harm if the the system does not have the RAM.

    Modifying Win-XP & Vista (especially Vista) is a risk you have to measure for yourself. These are well documented and known to work as you can see with the provided reference info.

    Effects on Linux / Mono: None have been noted by anyone using patched EXE files as Linux Handles memory differently but it is still subject to specific 32Bit limitations for 32Bit flavours.

    Additional REFERENCE INFORMATION
    http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/system/platform/server/pae/paemem.mspx
    http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=889654
    (shows mem capabilities & page sizing)
    http://bilbroblog.com/wow64/hidden-secrets-of-w0w64-ndash-large-address-space/

    Hope it helps.
    WhiteStar Magic

    WhiteStar Magic

    21 Oct 12 at 5:55 pm

  8. (deleted due to double post ’cause I’m using a crappy ISP connection)

    Sarge Misfit

    21 Oct 12 at 6:13 pm

  9. That’s a lot of stuff there, Whitestar, which I will be re-reading a few times to get it all.

    Regarding Cool VL’s mesh support, I am now left scratching my head wondering why the menu entries for mesh are greyed out on my end. AMD Athlon quad core, 2500Mhz, 6Gb RAM, Win 7 64bit on my end.

    When it comes to the vehicles, mine already detect the change from land to water. For flight, I plan on using a manual switch on the vehicle. Mine are easier, though, since my vehicles don’t ‘morph’. No wheels or wings to retract or extend. I have those planned, but one thing at a time. And, like you, I have too much time invested to make the scripts open source (sorry folks).

    Sarge Misfit

    21 Oct 12 at 6:15 pm

  10. @ Sarge: You can find the LAA doc in \Aurora-Sim\AuroraDocs Which I committed way back in time but still stands. I use Method-2 with the external app to set LAA to TRUE for OpenSim and my viewers when needed. I also run things on Win-7/64 Pro, Vista-32 Media Centre and on XP-Pro all of which have their own hardware.

    It may be possible that in your case the Video Card / Video Drivers are responsible for the lack of Mesh in CV. The previous NVidia drivers had a few bugs when released, some of which were downright “nasty” with ghosting and x-imaging desktop icon’s etc… The latest driver suite which I am running is working perfectly and I am getting Real Time FPS over 50 frames in most viewers, these report as floating between 30-55 fps using the viewer stats panel and sometimes as low as 5 fps when everything is rendered and in cache. Yes That’s right, less FPS when in cache as it is NOT pulling it down the wire, does not mean that the actual FPS is low, it’s just not being sent by the simulator as it’s already there & rendered. (I can hear the argumentors now but facts are facts)

    NOTE: Something that a LOT of folks get confused over is how FPS is displayed within a viewer. What people are perceiving as “true fps” is not what they are actually getting. By design & by codebase, the FPS that is reported by the viewer is an aggregate FPS which is affected by many things including Physics responses, simulator/region response timing and script timing which affects simulator frame output. Few people refer to the known & documented process and impacts but if you search for it, you’ll find it. I have in the past provided links to the technical & explanatory documentation related to this issue but people choose to fall back onto the old wives tales & popular beliefs rather than the technical knowledge of it.

    WhiteStar Magic

    21 Oct 12 at 6:58 pm

  11. Well, I’m running an nVidia GeForce 9500GT with 1Gb RAM on the card. Cool VL’s mesh was working on that same video card, but that was on a single core 64bit machine with 3Gb RAM and Vista 32bit. I believe that Vista doesn’t do LAA above 3Gb.

    I transferred the video card to the new machine and am running as I commented above, 4core Win7 64bit and 6Gb RAM. I’ve had no problems with LAA on the single core machine (which now has 4GB RAM and is running Win7 64bit as well) or my newer quadcore.

    And its only Cool VL that has mesh disabled on my end. I have absolutely no issues with any other mesh supporting viewer. I can only conclude that the problem is with the viewer, not the computer. :-) Since I only use Cool VL to export unscripted builds, I’m not overly concerned. I know that mesh support is there and do report that on the MIV.

    Sarge Misfit

    21 Oct 12 at 10:00 pm

  12. To add, i use the 2nd way tho make the open sims exec run on my xp 32b with 3 giga ram!
    I use imprundence to build on OSG cause without shadows is still the best graphics viewer, period!
    Wish that i could have Niran’s on OSG, not only due to its graphics quality and stability, but cause its build menu is much more intuitive then any other, v1 style viewers included!
    Can’t wait to see a viewer with defered rendinging and tone mapping that works on Open sims, so far the only ones that i know that use it (Exodus and Niran’s that manage to makde it perfect) don’t want to support Open sims!
    As sooner LL will include tone mapping, ported from Exodus, perhaps then other viewers will improve their graphics (Firestorm lacks a graphic quality that makes it unusable by me or my love on osg and is to unstable and prone to crashes on Sl)!
    And of course, i wish that physics engine, be bullet, Inworldz 1 or whatever be a reality the sooner, cause its lack was what made me return to Sl for good!
    Still until one can cross a sim border with a vehicle that is not a wearable, no matter its engine, Sl will have a edge (that they are really eager to destroy, as roll outs are making a mess again on mainland continents) that no other grid will beat and that makes users like me, sadly, stay there instead of being where all ists much easy and friendly, open sim non commercial grids!

    ZZ Bottom

    22 Oct 12 at 7:13 am

  13. I know someone using Vista 64 bit with dual AMD quadcore CPU server motherboard and three dual-GPU ATI video cards. They are somehow able to use all 48 Gb of ECC Registered RAM and all 6 Radeon GPUs, but I think the ATI cards are independent and not as a Crossfire set. Does Vista 64 bit normally have the capability of using more than 4 Gb of RAM because of PAE, like 64 bit versions of Xubuntu Linux do?.

    Sincerely,
    Mick Scarbridge (SL).

    Mick Scarbridge

    29 Sep 13 at 12:26 am

  14. *head spinning from techie talk* =p

    Ener Hax

    2 Oct 13 at 2:37 pm

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